Sharon Collon [00:00:03]:
Welcome, Dr. Mary, I am so excited for you to be here today.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:00:08]:
Thank you so much for having me. I'm very, very happy to be here.
Sharon Collon [00:00:12]:
So let's start off with you introducing yourself and telling us a little bit about what you do.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:00:20]:
So I'm Dr. Mary Barson, I'm a general practitioner and, and I have a keen interest in ADHD as well as a keen interest in weight loss and metabolic health. So I have many hats, as I'm sure a lot of the women listening to this podcast wear many hats. In addition to being a mum and busy with that, I work as a gp. I work as a GP in Headspace in Youth mental health and I also work in metabolic health. I run a fabulous business called Real Life medicine with another GP colleague, colleague of mine, Dr. Lucy Burns, where we do holistic health and weight loss courses and programs really designed specifically for busy women who want to improve their health, lose weight naturally, keep it off forever, and just live their best possible lives.
Sharon Collon [00:01:17]:
So good. And I've got so many questions because I know this is something that a lot of people in the audience have questions about from all your different hats. Actually, my brain is going off in a thousand times, but let's bring it back in, let's bring it back in. Sharon, so tell us a little bit. I know that you've shared that you have PCOS and struggled with weight management. Can you tell us about your personal journey with this?
Dr. Mary Barson [00:01:42]:
Yeah, so I've struggled with my weight my whole life. I first became like significantly overweight when I was about 8 years old and struggled with it forever, you know, and, and all of the things, all of the bullying, all of the psychological damage that went with that, lots of well meaning adults, you know, telling me to go on diets, lots of things that were very, very hard and it just got worse and worse. No matter what I did throughout my adolescence, I gained weight throughout my early adulthood to the point where I was like considered to be clinically obese. But, and meanwhile I was like a health conscious person, especially exercise, you know, I swam, I swam competitively, not like, you know, just local level, definitely not that talented, but I, you know, I was fit, I was strong. But despite exercising and, you know, largely, but not always following the advice of doctors and dietitians, I just couldn't control my weight and had a lot of shame about that. Nothing I ever did really worked. And later on I became a doctor and I still was unable to control my weight as a doctor, which had added layers of difficulty and shame. And it really wasn't until I sort of, I stumbled across, like that, how to truly improve my metabolism, what truly helps with metabolic health, that I was able to turn my health around.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:03:06]:
And then the next layer was learning to improve my. My mindset and all of the psychological tools that I needed to be able to keep on track, that I was able to, yeah. Lose weight, keep it, maintain a really sort of a great metabolic health. And it's that time where I really developed a passion in metabolic health and helping other people improve their metabolism. So what I mean by improve my metabolism is that I just needed to change, you know, what I ate and really focusing on real whole foods, really focusing on prioritizing my protein, keeping my sugar and starch low. When I did that and actually wasn't all that hard, but when I found a way to do that and I found a way to make it work for me, for me, everything turned around and I haven't looked back. And it's just been a beautiful, transformational moment in my life.
Sharon Collon [00:04:01]:
What an awesome journey. Now you have disclosed to me that you have adhd, right?
Dr. Mary Barson [00:04:05]:
I do, yes.
Sharon Collon [00:04:07]:
Which you are on the right podcast.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:04:09]:
For that, aren't I? That's right.
Sharon Collon [00:04:11]:
So tell me how you think ADHD has impacted your journey.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:04:17]:
Yeah. So there's strong correlations between overweight obesity and adhd. That, that doesn't mean that everybody with ADHD is going to be overweight and everybody who's overweight is going to have adhd. They're both fairly complex, multifactorial, multigenetic kind of conditions. Don't like to use the word disorder. I'm sure you're. You'd be there with me. I also don't like the word obesity, but from a medical standpoint, it is a useful term to kind of, you know, everyone knows what I mean when I say that I would never tell a person they were obese, and I didn't like being told that I was obese.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:04:48]:
So they really do correlate. So I think for me, I. I didn't have the right advice. I was told to, you know, reduce what I ate, restrict calories to move more. And when I did that, I just couldn't lose weight long term. I could maintain it for a little bit, but I couldn't maintain it long term. And most people would experience that. That's the.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:05:06]:
What's. What's behind yo yo dieting with calorie restriction, you can lose weight, but you can't keep it up. But I think as someone with adhd, and I wasn't diagnosed. My ADHD wasn't diagnosed until quite recently, I think, a few years ago. So undiagnosed ADHD for much of my life, that, that becomes. Because if you're telling someone that the only way they're going to be able to maintain their health is by white knuckling their way through calorie restriction, feeling hungry, denying yourself the foods that are going to provide a little dopamine hit, that are going to provide the stimulation that you're after, it's just doomed to fail. So what I needed was to find a way to work with my beautiful brain rather than trying to work against it, because working against it was never ever going to work.
Sharon Collon [00:05:52]:
I want to narrow in on some common things that people with ADHD experience when they are looking at their overall health or weight loss. You know, like things like binge eating, kind of that nothing approach, the black and white thinking and anything else that you want to add to that. Because I think it's important to highlight for the people listening that maybe some of the things that they're experiencing aren't a lack of willpower, because willpower, you know, that actually are adhd. So I'd love for you to, to tell us a little bit about that.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:06:24]:
Yeah, absolutely. And yes, you don't need willpower to, to lose weight. It's not a lack of willpower, it's, it's a lack of skills and mindset skills, maybe a lack of understanding your mind. So it's all very obtainable. So both overweight obesity and ADHD have got a commonality that we see in the scientific literature that it's to do with dopamine signalling and that there are differences in dopamine signaling and this can be particularly challenging someone with adhd. Certain areas of the brain, the dopamine signalling just doesn't work as well. So people with adhd, they go searching for the dopamine and this is just normal. There's nothing shameful about this, this is just what human brains do.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:07:08]:
And this can be a good thing and this can be a really bad thing. And ways in which we go hunting for that, that dopamine hit is with foods, often hyper palatable foods, and this can lead to overeating foods that aren't necessarily helpful, eating foods that are unhelpful, like the hyper palatable, high sugary processed foods, more often than we need to. The other thing with that can happen with ADHD is when we're hyper focusing on another task, which again can be one of our superpowers, is that we can just not eat. We can just forget to eat for extended periods of time. And then you're. By not having that interoception and being able to pick up on your body's cues, not eating for a while, you then suddenly get very hungry. And that is when, like a binge can occur and binges are often not good for our health. Then there is also, I think that I mentioned it before, that searching for stimulation, that is another thing that people with ADHD can do with when they're looking for food.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:08:10]:
So it might be eating food when we're not hungry necessarily. So all of these things can add up. There's also a strong correlation between binge eating disorder and adhd. And there is a difference between just binge eating and binge eating disorder are not necessarily the same thing. If you have a few, like, binge eating is sort of like moments of uncontrolled eating when we sort of eat more than when we would, maybe more than like a normal person would, whatever that means. But binge eating disorder is, is something different. It's when it happens quite frequently to the point where it's really starting to impact function, physical health and mental health. So that they're different, but they're, they're related.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:08:51]:
And this is something that, that the ADHD brain is vulnerable to do.
Sharon Collon [00:08:56]:
And we also know things like anorexia, arfid, you know, like these are the things that are more common with ADHD too.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:09:02]:
Definitely. And we say that a lot in children and that picky eating, sensory issues around food can be more common in adhd, which can make eating sort of nutritious, well balanced meals harder. It's not impossible, but it is harder. So it's more important than ever, I think, to find the strategies that work for you and also work for your family and work for your kids when you've got adhd. Because there are these added layers of complexity and I think a cookie cutter approach, you know, that you know, when you just. Someone waggles their finger at you and tells you just, just eat better, have more fruit and veggies, eat more protein, sit down at the table and have your family meals together might not work for you and your family. And instead you might need to be more flexible and adaptable. Especially kids with, I see this a lot in headspace.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:10:02]:
Kids with sensory issues around food and that certain foods, they might not like the look or the smell of the touch and even sometimes seeing other people's food can be really upsetting for them. And I think that it can Be helpful to let go of some of those neuronormative views around eating. And still you, still what you eat is really important. We still want to make sure that we're eating good foods. But maybe it's not absolutely necessary for all families to have dinner at the table. Maybe it's okay if a child wants to, to go and eat their food separately or if a child's upset by what their brother's doing, to do it separately. Maybe it's okay to eat meals at different times. You can play around with it.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:10:49]:
I think one thing that is pretty much universally helpful for anybody who wants to lose weight, for anybody who wants to improve their metabolic health and for children with adhd, especially children who are on stimulant medication that may potentially reduce their appetite, is to have a high protein breakfast. If you can do that, then you are really winning. And it doesn't have to be at the dinner table or the breakfast table. It can be anywhere. But a high protein breakfast, like, you know, just throw out the cereal, that is great. You are setting yourself up for health throughout the day. Protein is really important for our health and wellbeing. And there is good, good evidence showing that a higher protein diet is going to help with weight loss, improve blood sugar control.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:11:36]:
And we know that a high protein diet is important for children, children's development. And if you can start the day with protein, then you're winning.
Sharon Collon [00:11:48]:
I would love for you, I've got so many questions, but I would love for you to tell us a few options for a high protein because I see people get stuck on this now. Definitely, yeah. Do you mind if I share a couple of hours that we do because we definitely listen to this advice. I just pre make these little like burger patty risotto things and they live in the freezer and I microwave them every morning like, and then a protein shake like a protein, like a nice like one that without all the crazy in it. And I put that in, in a little bit of a smoothie for the boys and that's their protein breakfast. It's quick. I don't have to cook anything, I just microwave it and that's been quite good. What, what are your thoughts? What can we do to build on that to give people some options?
Dr. Mary Barson [00:12:27]:
Yeah, that's great. It doesn't have to just be boiled eggs, like that's all. Or eggs. That's what people think of high protein breakfast. But I don't like eggs. My child doesn't like eggs. It doesn't have to be eggs. You don't have to eat eggs if you don't want to.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:12:37]:
I'm a big fan of breakfast can be anything. It doesn't have to be breakfast food. So yeah, pre made burgers are great. I love little pre made make little. This is eggs. So not everyone likes eggs but this works. So scramble up some eggs, chop up some bacon, little bits of tomato, whatever your kids like and or ham and put them in little muffin trays and then cook them and so it's just a nice little like frittata basically ready to go super quick. The other thing my, my two year old loves is a piece of cheese, like just a piece of hard cheese wrapped in ham.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:13:12]:
He loves it, he calls it a roll up. And so that's a really, really quick and easy one. Any kind of what you could have, whatever you have for dinner you can have for breakfast. That can be super easy. So my kid will actually I make kind of like quite a lot of crumbed fish at home and I could just quickly just chuck it in the air fryer for like a minute and she'll eat some crumbed fish for breakfast. That works quite well. I also like making these homemade hash browns. So that's when you get grated zucchini, a bit of and or grated potato and mix it in with egg and grated cheese and just fry it.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:13:50]:
So it's got a lot of egg, it's got a lot of cheese in it and we call them hash browns. They're very popular and I've got picky kids so picky eaters for children and then I think get the smoothies. Great. If you can find a good quality protein powder. Smoothies aren't necessarily super helpful for adults wanting to lose weight but I think they are a great way for kids to get their protein in and there's some good products out there. You can chuck in some fruit, you can chuck in some extra things and make it palatable.
Sharon Collon [00:14:19]:
Excellent. That's really good because I think breakfast often we we've been told that we need to have protein for breakfast but a lot of people get stuck. It's a time intense part of the day. We know that it's not really our family's time to shine in the morning and so having a. There were some really great options. I would love to to on shoulds. Right. So in ADHD coaching we are trained to listen out for when clients say should.
Sharon Collon [00:14:45]:
And I don't think there is any other topic that people say should as much as diet and weight loss. Totally can you touch on that and the shame that comes along?
Dr. Mary Barson [00:14:58]:
Yes. Shame is so counterproductive. You just, you cannot hate yourself well, you cannot break yourself thinner. It is not only does it, is it bad for our mental health, it is literally counterproductive. It literally makes health and weight loss harder to obtain. And as that, the beautiful ADHD brain can be wired to feel shame more intensely. And also if we can think about all the little micro traumas that people can experience growing up either with weight issues or with, you know, a beautifully different brain, that all of those little traumas, all those little bullyings, all those little exclusions, even if it's not massive trauma, it can still really add up to make us feel more vulnerable to shame. So, yeah, shame is not your friend in any way.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:15:50]:
I think that how you can tackle that is two things. We use a lot of cognitive behavioural therapy in our courses and our programs and what, getting to understand your thoughts is helpful. So with shame, just understand that shame is your brain's way of trying to keep you safe, trying to protect you. Your brain wants you to be included, your brain wants you to be safe and feeling good. And if it can include, it can feel these episodes of shame, it as a way to try and keep you safe, try and keep you on the straight and narrow. So I think it's important to try and make friends with your shame or even to accept that. Shame, guilt, embarrassment, all of these things, they are a normal part of our experience. So making a bit of room for them is one part.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:16:49]:
And the other thing, it's shining a light on it. Shame hates the light. It, it really thrives in the dark. So shining a light on it, talking about it. And this is something, this is where a coach like your beautiful self can be great. And I'm like a weight loss coach, so that can be a really useful thing. Talking about it can be helpful. Sharing it in safe places is a great way to reduce shame and then just have that understanding of why it's there and understanding of why it's not helpful.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:17:20]:
And shame can make us act in ways that can be quite counterproductive. So, for example, it might make us want to be really people pleasers. We might want to, you know, be tying ourselves in knots to try and make sure that everyone around us is always okay at our own detriment. But if you could think about from our brain's point of view, there might have been a time in our life, particularly as kids, where that was actually really helpful, it might have actually helped us survive or Navigate a difficult situation. If we could be a people pleaser to the kids around us in primary school, maybe our lives were just easier and better and they were easier to navigate. Maybe we needed to people please the adults in our lives. So it's a behavioral pattern that did actually serve us at one time. But like a pair of shoes that you WORE in grade six, they protected your feet when you had 12 year old sized feet.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:18:12]:
But you don't have 12 year old sized feet anymore. And these shoes, if you still try and jam them onto your feet, are going to hurt you. Doesn't mean you need to hate the shoes. It just means you can hang the shoes up, you can just put them on the shelf and say thank you shoes, you were fabulous, but I don't need you anymore. It's a similar thing with your shame, with your people, pleasing with whatever it is that you're. Whatever pattern is in your brain was helpful. It's not helpful anymore. You don't need to hate it.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:18:39]:
You definitely don't need to hate yourself. You can thank it, you can thank that part of you and just let it go.
Sharon Collon [00:18:46]:
Oh, I love that analogy. I want to touch on now impulsivity and ET Right, because this is where I know a lot of my clients talk about it like they, they just not are not able to do. The power of the pause. The power of the pause is something that we really like in coaching and something that we can learn, but it takes a lot of practice. But that impulsivity of, you know, going for something, grabbing it, having it and then beating ourselves up about it. Do you tools to help us with that impulsive eating?
Dr. Mary Barson [00:19:17]:
Definitely. I think there's lots of tools. In fact, in our coaching programs we call them hot tools. So you've got your hot tools and your cool tools. Your hot tools are the tools when you're in the moment where the craving is there and you would just literally murder someone for some cream crackers. You're the overwhelm of, you know, the anger, the frustration, the shame, the guilt, what the craving, whatever. It's. You're in that moment.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:19:38]:
And yes, it would be wonderful if we have a little pause, take a deep breath and we could engage our prefrontal cortex and we could make a more balanced decision. But in that moment, our emotional brain is in charge. So you need to have your hot tools and I think you need to have a variety so really good ones. I think in that moment of that hot tool is it. I know it seems so trite, but honestly, just taking a moment to ground yourself. So a deep breath. Breath is amazing. Breath is our natural tranquiliser.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:20:08]:
When you're in that moment and you're in that activated situation, all these physiological things are happening to you. Your heart rate is elevated, your blood pressure is elevated, your pupils are dilated, you're more hyper vigilant. You, your gut is, you've got blood pulling away from your gut, you've got your blood sugar elevating. You're already, your muscles are getting ready to fight or flight. See, when we're in a hyper aroused state like that, and cravings are also a hyper aroused state, some part of our brain, a deeper sort of part of our brain honestly thinks that we're being attacked by a bear. It's sort of, it can't tell that we're actually just in this state because we're hyperstimulated. The, the kids are cranky and hungry and running around, the sink is full of dishes like mom, where's dinner? Where's dinner? Where's dinner? And you just realize that you needed to pay that bill and you've got to get your child ready for dance and she's refusing to put on her underpants. And all of these things are happening.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:21:06]:
Our brain, biologically, we think we're being attacked by a bear. And the other thing that's happening during all this is our respiratory rate goes up and we cannot consciously control any of that. Your heart rate, your blood sugar, what's happening in your muscles, what your liver's doing, dumping out sugar, none of that we can control except for our breath. That is the one thing that we can easily consciously override. So a big deep breath is not to be underestimated. It just doing that can send signals of safety to our emotional brain. And that can help re engage that thinking brain, our prefrontal cortex, a little bit more. And then that can send more signals of safety to our emotional brain.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:21:51]:
We can logically understand we're not being chased by a bear. And so the thinking brain can come a bit more online. That's helpful. Other things are you bringing yourself back into the moment. So pinching your fingers, not hard but like really like feeling your fingernails pushing on the bridge of your, of your, the bridge of your nose can be helpful. These things can just ground you to the moment. Anything that can ground you right then and there can be helpful. And we teach other tools too.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:22:29]:
Like tapping. Probably won't go into it now, but eft. And tapping is a useful tool. Having a little imaginary remote control in your mind, one that Says stop, pause, play. And just in the recognize those moments of overwhelm, just push, stop and take a deep breath and then push, pause, take a moment to notice what's happening around you. Tune into what you're feeling with kindness and curiosity, without judgment. And then when you're feeling a little bit calmer, push, play and then move on with a better understanding. So lots of little tools that can be helpful in that moment.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:23:09]:
The other part of it though is if when you're in that moment and you do eat all the cream crackers because of the craving, or you do scream at your kids, or you do react in a way that is not in line with your values, it's not in line with you want for yourself, you don't want to lose twice. So you want to be mindful of the shame spiral. So if you do eat a whole bunch of cream crackers that you didn't want to eat, for example, then feeling shame and guilt about that is only going to compound the problem and may make you want to spiral down into eating all of the cream crackers and feeling even worse about yourself. So mentioned before, shame hates the light. So just being aware of what happened, accepting it and, and finding a way to be kind to yourself because we are all human and to be human is to err. And accepting that you're human, accepting that you have, that you suffer, accepting that you're imperfect can also help curb that cycle so it doesn't go on and on and on and you don't continue to lose and you don't continue to suffer.
Sharon Collon [00:24:17]:
I love that so much. And that really gives us strategies for that. On or off, you know, kind of when we're on the diet or we're off the diet, right?
Dr. Mary Barson [00:24:25]:
Yes. Such so unhelpful. And it's normal though, like yeah, I get that all the time. Hey, Dr. Mary, look, I'm an all or nothing person, so I'm either just going to be doing it perfectly or I won't do it at all. People just come in and that's like their opening line. I'm like, well that ain't going to work. So you need to be able to accept that you're human and cultivate that self compassion which is a learnable skill even if you've got coming out from a low base.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:24:50]:
And also just know that you don't need to be perfect. In fact, not only do you not need to be perfect, you can't be perfect. And which is great because you don't need to be perfect, it just it's what you do most of the time that matters. It's definitely not what you do all the time.
Sharon Collon [00:25:04]:
I would love to know what getting diagnosed with ADHD meant for you, because I think that women with adhd, they tell me all, like, there's such a range of experiences and you, you mentioned that you got diagnosed quite recently, so I'd love to hear a little bit more about that. Yeah.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:25:22]:
So it was when a lot of ADHD was being diagnosed in my family more broadly and, and I'd always laughed at myself saying, you know, I have ADHD traits, you know, because I've always known that, you know, I could be vague. I've always known that I could hyper focus. I've always known these bits of myself, but never like, you know, I was functioning. And wasn't that the old thought that, you know, if you were a functioning human being who could get through medical school, you couldn't possibly have adhd. And, you know, I didn't throw things. I wasn't a little like Tasmanian typ, tiger, a devil around the classroom. I was actually a little people pleaser of a little girl. So I couldn't possibly have adhd.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:26:01]:
But then, yeah, so it was happening in my family and so I thought, actually, I think this might be me. And I went along and saw a psychiatrist colleague of mine and he was like, clearly you do. So it was actually painful, I think. I think it was sad was probably how I felt. I felt sad for my past self, retrofitting that ADHD diagnosis into my life and seeing that, that little girl that I was and the ways in which she might have been helped, but she wasn't. The ways in which she might have understood herself, but she didn't. Just made me feel sad. And it wasn't necessarily a bad sad, I think it was a helpful sad, but it was still painful.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:26:45]:
But I think also very useful for me personally, also professionally. I think being able to. It's brought a much better awareness, I think, to my practice. I've started looking for ADHD pretty much subconsciously, particularly in the girls and women that I see, but definitely not exclusively. And overall helpful, but sad. Yeah.
Sharon Collon [00:27:18]:
You know, you are not alone in that feeling. Like, think of, you know, the, the stereotype, the. The what my husband essentially was like, he got branded the naughty boy. Right. Like the hyperactive boy. But there was a blessing to that in the way that he got intervention early.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:27:37]:
Yes. Right, yeah.
Sharon Collon [00:27:38]:
And he got support early. You know, there was no mistaking it.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:27:42]:
Right.
Sharon Collon [00:27:42]:
So. But all the. I often think about some of the other children in his classroom that would have also been going through similar things, but they missed it because they were just quiet about it.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:27:55]:
Totally. Yeah. I went through most of primary school thinking that I was quite stupid and I've since discovered pretty quickly I wasn't stupid. But I struggled with attention and my handwriting was abysmal and my. I was not, I'm not. And to this day I'm not good at mental arithmetic. I've got dyscalculia. And in my primary school, your entire academic success was based on your handwriting and your ability to do mental arithmetic.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:28:20]:
So I wasn't, wasn't. I was just sort of quietly, oh, well, poor Mary. Yeah, you know, she's. She's not the best. Certainly not. Not. She's not. She's close to the worst, but not the worst.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:28:29]:
But when I hit high school and all of a sudden I could type and maths became far more than just mental arithmetic because I'm actually quite good at maths. Maths, facts, not mental arithmetic. Still not good at that. Then for me, that's when I sort of was able to. My self esteem was be able to grow and I could latch onto this other side of myself. But it is sad looking back at that, that little girl who, you know, had developed this early opinion of herself and I. Yeah, I think she would have really have benefit. Benefited from some help and some understanding.
Sharon Collon [00:28:58]:
And I'm so happy that through your work and you know, your practice and also headspace that you are supporting others to.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:29:04]:
Yes.
Sharon Collon [00:29:05]:
Avoid that. Like, what a beautiful thing to do. Okay, a little bit of a controversial question. Now this is something different. I want to know what your personal opinion is on Ozempic and Manjaro on all of those sorts of things.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:29:18]:
Yeah. So useful. How can I call myself a weight loss doctor and not talk about Ozempic and Mounjaro? So I think for a long time I. My opinion was pretty dark on weight loss medications prior to Ozempic and Mounjaro because all we had was Saxander and it was not impressive. Like it just didn't work that well, to be honest. So people were exposing themselves to all of these side effects of the reflux and the possible pancreatitis and all these problems for extremely unimpressive amounts of weight loss. But then, you know, the pharmacotherapy improved and enter stage left semaglutide and parazite and all of its other other forms. And they are helpful.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:30:02]:
So they're a tool. I think essentially they are A tool for weight loss. They are not for everybody. They do have problems and risks and I'm conservative with them as I am actually conservative with all medications. I'm definitely not anti medications. Medications can be life changing and life saving and really helpful, but they need to be treated with great respect. So I think they can be helpful. The type of.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:30:36]:
In our courses and programs at Real Life Medicine we encourage and teach like high protein, really satiating diet, that lifestyle that's lower in sugar and starch and you know, teach people how to make sweets and, and cocktails and things if they want to in a way that is helpful and supportive of their body. And just this particular way of eating actually Natur actually increases your own endogenous GLP1 hormones are kind of like boosts your own natural Ozempic if you like. Which doesn't mean that Ozempic and Mounjara aren't helpful. Actually they can work synergistically. So one way to get the most out of your weight loss medications is to go on a higher protein, lower carbohydrate diet. They work really well together. So I do know that people can get a lot of, you know, they can get weight loss with lifestyle changes alone. And the beautiful thing about a higher protein, lower starch diet is that it also reduces that food noise.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:31:35]:
So when you stop feeding your sugar cravings and you stop feeding your carbohydrate cravings, they die down. It's amazing to watch. It can take a little while initially, especially if you're needing a lot of sugar to deal with if dopamine hits or if you're needing a lot of sugar because of sugar addiction, your brain initially has a tantrum. But if you move past that, that kind of, that rehab phase, that sort of detox phase, sorry, into the rehab phase, then it just quietens down. Interestingly, these medications also quieten down food noise. So I know that can be really helpful for a lot of people. The reason I'm cautious is I think they're still relatively new. We don't know a lot about them.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:32:20]:
And I always have this little voice in the back of my mind like what is it that we don't know about these medications? What are the harms that we don't know? But I also know that there are a lot of harms for people living here right now who have got significant weight issues, that they've got significant problems with food noise and that they can be helpful right now. But I'm just cautious. So I would like people to be on the lowest dose possible. And that is where a high protein, low carb diet is helpful. And I would like to create some kind of off ramp so people don't necessarily need to be on them forever. But even then we just don't really, we don't have a lot of data or expertise on what next. How do people come off this? And there is some research definitely that the high protein, low carb diet could be an off ramp for people. So these are all the things I think of.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:33:13]:
I do prescribe them. I don't prescribe them a heck of a lot, but I do a bit and I certainly lots of people who do our courses are on these medications and very, very happy to help and guide these people. So it's an interesting. Watch this space, I reckon.
Sharon Collon [00:33:28]:
I mean, I love that you said it's kind of a compliment because, you know, even if people are perhaps listening that are on it, they still need, it's a little bit like, like, I guess I'm looking at it from an ADHD medication lens. I say like the pills don't give you the skills, they level the playing field, right? So like you need like you can have ADHD medication and it's amazing, like life changing for a lot of people, but still need to develop executive functions, skills and, and as tools around it. And I guess it's the same kind of thing. Like, yes, you can do that, but you still need to have lifestyle changes and, and like be able to, you know, have good dietary information and, you know, so that you can come off these or, you know, look after your whole self. Like it's.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:34:14]:
Yes, yeah, absolutely. And I think that one thing I didn't mention was the emotional side of things. So we see this a lot with people who've had like gastric banding surgery, for example. It's a tool, so it's a thing that you do, you know, and that it's useful. I'm not gonna lie that sometimes gastric banding can be extremely helpful for people. But if it doesn't deal with the upstream emotional and psychological component where people are using food to soothe, to stimulate, to reward, to punish, all of these things that we use food for that isn't just nourishing our body, that doesn't magically go away because we've had surgery or magically go away because we're on injectable weight loss medications or magically go away because we just, we just do a diet for a little while. You know, all of the diet, the, the injectables, the surgery These are tools and they are helpful, but you have to deal with the upstream thoughts and the upstream skills and those psychological skills we mentioned before. You don't need discipline.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:35:18]:
It's not discipline that you need. You don't have a discipline deficit, it's skills. And executive functioning skills are so cheap among those skills to deal with your thoughts, to deal with your emotions and to deal with them in helpful and positive ways. And these can help, but they are not everything.
Sharon Collon [00:35:37]:
Oh, love that answer so much. So, if you were going to leave our listeners with perhaps three key things. So say we've got a mum listening, she's got adhd, she's got ADHD kids, She's got, you know, like, she's a avid listener to this podcast. What are three things that she could do that would support her. Her diet?
Dr. Mary Barson [00:35:59]:
Yeah. Yep, That's a good one. All right, so think protein first. Just. Just start with the protein and if you like to count, aim for at least 30 grams of protein per meal. If you don't like counting, if that just makes you sort of vomit a little bit in your mouth, don't worry about it. But protein first. So you want to prioritize your protein for every meal and that.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:36:25]:
I think just doing that alone can make a really big difference. The other thing is, think about what are your real vulnerabilities? Where do you think, what are the behaviours that you're doing right now that are not serving you with your health and weight loss? And think about how can you make the right thing easy and the wrong thing hard? So, classic example is, if it's binging on cream crackers when you come home from work, then can you just not have the cream crackers, can you just get them out of your house? Or if you can't get them out of your house, because it is literally the only thing that you know some person will eat or something like that, or that, you know you need them. Can you quarantine them? So can you just put them somewhere else? Maybe in a locked can? They're not locked. You could lock it if you want to. But like a closed container, could you put a little note on it saying, not helpful. Can you just do something to increase the resistance between wanting, you know, the chocolate, eating the chocolate, can you just make it a little bit harder? Just put a few. Little bit of resistance in there. If you don't have the chocolate in your house, brilliant.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:37:31]:
But, you know, if you can't, just. So you give yourself a little bit of time to make that gap between the Urge and the eating. Can you just make it a bit harder? People keep their chocolate in the freezer so they have to bring it out, wait for it to warm up. You know, that's not hard. I know someone, and I love this, lives with their teenage son who really wants to have his junkie food in the house. And that's just the way that it is. So she puts it on. He has his own shelf in the cupboard and she's put it, she goes to Bunnings and got some hazard type.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:37:59]:
It says caution has it and she puts that over the shelf. So she's like, oh, jelly beans hazard. Oh yeah. And it's just enough to sort of make it a bit harder. So yeah, you want to make, you want to make the wrong thing harder and what can you do to make the right thing easier? So just think if you just do one thing a day, what can I do to make it easier for me to have my protein, for example? And I love, we talked about this, the pre cooked rissoles. I've got my pre cooked little frittatas. You've got your anything that you just grab and go. Ham and cheese rolls.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:38:35]:
What can you do to make the right thing easy and the wrong thing harder?
Sharon Collon [00:38:39]:
Love that so much. Now tell me, tell our audience where they can find you.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:38:45]:
Oh, yes. So real life medicine, holistic health and weight loss courses, you can find [email protected] and we've got lots of fabulous freebies on there. We've got a wonderful blog and a recipes and an ebook that you can have a look at. And we also have a podcast, our podcast is called Real Health and Weight Loss. And come along and join us there. That would be wonderful.
Sharon Collon [00:39:14]:
Amazing. Thank you so much for your time today. Dr. Mary.
Dr. Mary Barson [00:39:18]:
Thank you. I've really enjoyed chatting to you.
