Episode 92: When Your Ex Doesn’t Believe in ADHD:
Host: Sharon Collon
If your ex doesn't believe in ADHD, this one's for you. Here's something most people never slow down to think about. By their eighth birthday, nearly twice as many children with ADHD have parents who've divorced compared to other kids. Nearly double. And almost nobody talks about what comes next when you're advocating for a child across two houses and the other parent doesn't see what you see. That's what this episode is about.
No villains, no court battles, just a family working out how to support a child across two different homes. My guest today is Carolyn Tate. Carolyn is a former parenting and health journalist, a late-diagnosed ADHD, and the founder of Women's Divorce Academy. Over the last seven years, she's helped close to a thousand women get through the hardest parts of divorce and come out the other side stronger than when they went in. We get into her own story.
What her ADHD gave her throughout it and the practical stuff. When we stop trying to convince the other parent and pour that energy into your child instead, how to handle two sets of rules on a child who really needs consistency and what to do when your kid comes home believing they're lazy.
What her ADHD gave her through it and the practical stuff. When to stop trying to convince the other parent and pour that energy into your child instead. How to handle two sets of rules with one child who needs consistency. Grab a cupper. Let's get into it.
Sharon Collon (01:37)
Welcome, Carolyn. I'm so happy to have you here today.
Carolyn (01:40)
Thank you. I'm thrilled to be here.
Sharon Collon (01:42)
So I want you to take me back to the moment where you knew your marriage was ending. Where were your children in that picture?
Carolyn (01:51)
Well, two of my three children were quite tiny. So my younger two were four and six. and then my elder child, it was actually from a previous relationship, was twelve, and he was starting to have some issues, which we now know were thanks to ADHD. But at the time I didn't know that. and my four-year-old ended up being diagnosed with ADHD too, but it was way too early to to know about that then.
Yea it was none of us ADHD wasn't on the radar for us at all at that point.
Sharon Collon (02:18)
so can you take me back to the moment where you knew your marriage was ending?
Carolyn (02:24)
It was a bit of a slow death, I think, but there was a moment, it was New Year's Eve when I knew for sure that we were not coming back from this. And I think he went to bed at about 9:30, 10 o'clock and just went, good night, I'm going to bed. That wasn't like a happy new year. It wasn't anything. And it was just like the way that we were at that point. And I think he was sleeping in our our son's room. And it was so it was pretty. It was pretty we had already kind of
I think the decision I had made the decision already, but that was the moment that I went, I can't, I don't want to be like this next New Year's Eve, you know? I wanna be celebrating and have a nice time. And so yeah. So we separated on the second of January.
Sharon Collon (02:59)
Wow. Okay. And I know a lot of our audience will be navigating this. And I think you've got so much wisdom to share with us. So you back to that moment. You were undiagnosed then. so you said your tactics was to delay everything. So your divorce ended up stretching out for years. knowing what you know now about your brain, what was actually going on for you there?
Carolyn (03:20)
Yeah, definitely I wouldn't call it a tactic, I would call it just what happened because I think I was so overwhelmed, by parenting three children. and also I was working part-time when my ex-husband moved out. So I suddenly had to build my business, I had to get some income. My as my eldest son had some behavior issues at the time and some mental health issues. And so I couldn't hold down a full-time job, which
As a I don't know, it I'm sure it's an ADHD thing as well but I don't do well working for other people anyway. but yeah, it wasn't so much that I was intentionally delaying, but it was I'm so overwhelmed, I can't look at that right now. I'll put that in the endless pile of things that I will look at later. and so I think we were separated for about two years before we were actually divorced.
Sharon Collon (04:06)
what your ADHD gave you in that time. Like what did it allow you to how did it support you?
Carolyn (04:11)
I've really been thinking about this because it's such an interesting question. But I think you know, obviously I had coping mechanisms around ADHD, but what ADHD gave me, I think, was the creativity to look at it from a different angle and go, how can I solve these problems? You know, I couldn't hold down a full-time job. I couldn't do the things that you would normally want to do. So I just went.
Hard on building my business at the time. I was a freelance journalist. So I was getting up at 4 a.m. writing the news, you know, working till eight, taking the kids to school and kindy, then coming home and working a full day, you know, and whatever, finding clients wherever I could. But I was really creative about finding work and making sure that we were covered all the time. It was white knuckle, but we got through it. I don't recommend it necessarily. but it definitely helped me to think outside the square.
Sharon Collon (05:00)
So Carolyn, tell me a little bit about you and what you do.
Carolyn (05:03)
Yeah, so I'm a former journalist and I run a business called Women's Divorce Academy, which is a service to, I like to say my mission is to end this divorce disadvantage for women. Women are still so disadvantaged by divorce and by you know financially and socially and and in their careers. Like there's so many different ways, and it all comes down to education and information. So I try to make sure that I supply those things for women and just help them through the process because.
Divorce is one of those things that, you know, hopefully you only have to do it once. I've done it twice. So I like to think I'm an expert. And and so I've been working with women for like the last seven years, just helping them through that process. And I engage experts and I link people up to what they need. and I have a podcast, Divorce with Carolyn, where I talk to experts and women who've been through it about, you know, what they've learned and how they've gone on to. And I like to say that, you know, you can turn your divorce into the best thing that ever happened to you.
if it's an opportunity right to to just start fresh and have a do-over and what do I want for my life. So that's the end goal. But the first bit is just getting through it without being completely devastated by, you know, what you're going through. So education, information, support.
Sharon Collon (06:12)
And when you talk about that, the woman's disadvantage in divorce, can you explain that to us?
Carolyn (06:17)
Yeah, there's all sorts of stats about the disadvantag disadvantages that women suffer from. A lot of women have given up their careers or taken a slowdown in their careers to raise children or to support a partner. we haven't quite gotten to that point. We like to think everything's equal, but it's not quite there yet. So there's a lot of sacrifices there. there's a lot of sacrifices in the finances as well. Women have missed out a lot of the time on superannuation, or they may be just pressured to take a deal, you know, a settlement deal that they doesn't
benefit them. A lot of women that I speak to are told that 50-50 is a fair split. And in Australia that's not the case. A lot of other factors are taken into account. And often women who earn less, have less savings are given a little bit more of a step up when it comes to that in divorce. So there's a lot of different ways that women can be disadvantaged. And often after the separation, too, the women are doing the bulk of the childcare. So they
potentially can't, you know, I think there's a statistic about that women earn, I can't remember the percentages off the top of my head and don't want to say the wrong thing, but women earn less after divorce. Men's income actually goes up because they can just dedicate themselves to their careers and often they do, which is great for them. But you know, I certainly as a woman, I wouldn't give up the the time that I have with my children. I think that's really important. But it's also important to be armed with all the information and to make sure that you're taking care of yourself and your family.
Now and into the future as best you can.
Sharon Collon (07:42)
Thank you for explaining that 'cause I think that's really helpful. a lot of the women that I talk to about divorce, it financial is one of the main reasons that they stay stuck. So
Carolyn (07:51)
Yes.
It they do. And I think in my experience, and again I don't have a stat to back this up, but in my experience, the women that I speak to, the most reluctant women are the women from better off families. The women that have more to lose, I think are the ones that are really reluctant to go.
Sharon Collon (08:06)
Mm-hmm. Okay. So you've talked about the gap between how you see your child and how the other parent sees your child or their child. when did you first notice that gap and what did it take to keep advocating when you were the only one in the room who actually believed it?
Carolyn (08:22)
Ooh, okay, so that's a big one. my now my elder child was diagnosed with ADHD and he was from a previous relationship. So I that was that was easy for me. I had sole custody of him and I was I was just taking care of him. But for my daughter, who's now 13, I first started to notice signs that she might have ADHD because my son and I had been diagnosed and she's very similar to us in lots and lots of ways. And
And had the same challenges with organizing herself and you know, just creating a bit of chaos everywhere she goes and in the nicest possible way. And so I took that to her dad and I said, you know, I think that we might need to have her assessed. Here's the background, here's what's going on. I've been diagnosed, you know, my son's been diagnosed, and he was very much not look, I won't say he didn't believe in it, but I would say that he wasn't entertaining it as an option.
but the goalposts kept changing. So first it was that he didn't think she had it and wasn't interested in having her assessed. And I tried to massage that a little bit, waited a little bit longer, tried to convince him, sent him all sorts of studies and statistics. He's a scientist, so I thought that would be helpful. and eventually I just gave up and went, I'm getting I'm just taking her. I'll get her assessed and you know, whatever happens after that we'll deal with that. So
I of course, you know, pediatricians in Australia too, like it was, I think we were on the waiting list for eight months before she was seen by somebody. They assessed her and diagnosed her. He didn't like that. and created such a kerfuffle with them that they ended up saying we don't we won't treat her, we don't want to see her anymore. It's too much trouble for us. Our lawyers have said no, thank you. So then I was back to square one of
Having to find another pediatrician. So I resolved at that point to take her myself and not even involve him. But of course, when you get to the treatment part of things, I needed his approval in order for her to have medication or anything like that. So then we had to try to bring him along again. And I got to the point where I realized it wasn't going to be effective to bring him along. So I prepared all my documents to file with the court to have sole parental responsibility for her health. So we were getting ready to do that.
when he finally acquiesced and said, okay, she can do it. So it and that entire process took probably two and a half years, something like that. So it was excruciating. Especially because she was struggling a lot at the time as well. So just had watching her, she was having meltdowns, she was really emotional. She missed like 50 years of school one year. 50 years, sorry, 50 days of school one year. And so you know, watching her go through all of this was just
so tough as a mum to watch her struggling and and know that there are things we can be trying to help her, but he didn't want to do that. so it was really hard, but the difference that it made when we finally got there was made it all worth it. So that was good.
Sharon Collon (11:03)
I think what you're describing is actually more common than we think, right? Of it's quite unusual for both parents, together or separated or divorced, to agree on ADHD. Like it's been my experience that nothing brings up more controversy than ADHD. You know, we had it in our family here with you know, my husband's family were very anti-meds at the start. And
very, very anti-meds and we really had to negotiate. They've completely changed their tune. So just so you know, like we've got really good information completely changed. But it was a lot at the start, you know, to navigate that and try and honor different people's opinions. all whilst trying to advocate for your beautiful daughter and get her that support. Like you you can see that she needs it. You're on the front line of seeing that she needs that support. So thank you for for letting us know that. I think it's really important.
Carolyn (11:51)
Yeah, and in actual fact I do reflect sometimes and think in a way it's easier being divorced because if we were still married and living in the same house, I wouldn't have the option of taking him to court. Well, it wouldn't go well anyway if I did. But you know, if you're married and you really disagree about things, that's even tougher, I think, to get through. For me, I could
you know, draw a line in the sand and say, this is it, like I'm really gung ho about this. And I, you know, I took I talked to a lawyer, I've got my documents ready to file. If we were married, I couldn't do that.
Sharon Collon (12:21)
Mm. It's a good point. It's a good point. Now I'm curious, now that your daughter has that support, has he changed his tune at all about it or is he still anti it?
Carolyn (12:30)
Well, it's a good question. I'm not entirely sure is the answer. We don't we don't do a lot of communicating between the two of us. And because our kids are teenagers, we we're very much in that parallel parenting kind of thing where he parents his way, I parent my way, and we don't work together. And that's just the best that we can do. So that's what has to happen. It would be lovely if we could talk about everything and do everything together, but that's just not the reality for all divorced.
families. So his last concern before she started medication was the side effects. And so you know, we took him through all of that and and had lots of conversations about that. And since she started the the medication, he hasn't asked me at all about her side effects. I don't think he's asked her either. I think he's asked her once or twice how it's going and she said good and that's been it. So yeah, there's no communication about it now.
Sharon Collon (13:16)
Do you have any advice for a mum that's sitting there listening to this podcast that is perhaps navigating a diagnosis that her ex does not accept?
Carolyn (13:24)
Yeah, look, I mean, every situation is different, but I think you really have to assess the kind of relationship that you have and how they handle conflict. And I know for me, it was a matter of recognizing that I was not going to convince him and I knew that. So I put a boundary up and I think everyone should be thinking about their child first, right? I mean, that's number one. Your child comes first, advocating for them comes first. So if you don't think that you're going to be able to reach an agreement.
I would say don't waste your energy trying to draw that boundary, look at what you have to do and communicate that. Say, I want to do this, you know, and I want to get them assessed. I'd like you to come, I'd like you to be involved. But if you don't want to be, that's up to you. you can't force somebody to do anything, especially exes. So I think it's a matter of just choosing your battles, putting your child at in you know, at the center of everything.
and obviously the child doesn't need to know all of the stuff that's going on around the peripheries, but just being really clear. Being really clear, being really certain in what you're doing and knowing that it's for the good of your child, taking the advice of health professionals and yeah, just being clear about what the next steps are going to be and then follow those next steps through, because that's the way that they'll respect, you know, what you're saying to them through the process.
If you don't agree to this, I'll take her on my own. Fine, no problem. You know, and if you don't if you don't take this professional advice that she needs medication, then I'm going to have to go to court to try to get an agreement here. I think it's just and it's not in a threatening way. I think it's just really very, you know, that Brene Brown clear is kind, right? I think it's just this is what I'm doing. I want you to come along as part of the process. But if you don't want to, I'll be doing it anyway. That was a really long way to answer that question.
Sharon Collon (15:03)
So much gold in it. I'm really glad that you said it because you know this is something, this is a really big weighty topic. And we know the stats on ADHD and divorce, right? Like it's high. I'm I think you were quite shocked by the stats of
Carolyn (15:17)
Was. I mean, you know, anecdotally sure. I but yeah, but wow. Yeah.
Sharon Collon (15:21)
So it's quite high, and there's some really good books about it too. there is the ADHD effect on marriage by Melissa Olov, and there's the Dirty Laundry Book, which I think is quite good too. Both of them have very different perspectives, though, which is very interesting. But I think that there is just this general confusion about how to handle it. And you put it in the center of this very emotional, vulnerable time. And we've kind of
Got no playbook for it. So I love the work that you're doing in terms of helping people navigate through this time because it's it is very tricky.
So let's talk about two homes, two sets of rules, children in the middle of it, children with perhaps ADHD two who need that consistency support. What are your thoughts? Do you have any tips about this?
Carolyn (16:05)
wow. Well, this is, you know, this goes back as well to to recognizing what you have control over and what you don't have control over. And a lot of women that I work with try so hard to have the same rules in both houses and you know, to communicate how important that is to their ex and all of that stuff. And at some point, again, you have to go, I can't control that. this is my space. This is what I can control. While my child is here, I am going to make them feel as secure.
As possible. I'm going create these systems for them and I'll make it as easy as I can.
Yeah, I think consistency in one house is all you can do. and as I know there are lots of exes who work really nicely together. And if that's what you have, that's fantastic. Totally do that. Talk about it. You know, I go and have a coffee and talk about the rules that you have and how you're gonna help your child move between homes and what time sleep, bedtime is in each home and how you do everything. If you can keep it consistent, that's amazing. But if you can't, just really focus on what you can do to support them.
in your home and I used to have a a packing list on the fridge that the kids needed to take every time they went to their dads, they had that first it was pictures, then it was words. And it was just, you know, do you have you checky list this morning? Do you have all those things? and then when they go to their dad's place, I had to reach a point where I went, that's none of my business. And I would like for them to be as safe and secure as possible. But at the end of the day, I don't have any control over there.
So I want them to be able to come to me and tell me if they need things, if they're struggling with anything, I'll help them. But I'm not sticking my nose in that business at all.
Sharon Collon (17:32)
Hmm. And you know, I want to also reassure the listener that our kids navigate different sets of rules and different things all the time. School has a different set of rules to home. Nan's house has a different set of rules to home. Like they are navigating that sort of stuff already. Like we don't need necessarily like it's not the be all and end all if both households don't run on exactly the same sets of rules. Our kids have already got reps on the board for navigating different scenarios.
Carolyn (17:55)
Yeah, absolutely. I think kids with ADHD, especially, you know, they're they've already learned that, right? Like they're as much as it can be a bit of a struggle, I think as well, they're pretty adaptable because they have to be.
Sharon Collon (18:05)
Yes. So tell me, I've got a different kind of question now. When women come to work with you and they're showing up and they get your support services, what are they saying to you? Like what are their main friction points that they're saying?
Carolyn (18:19)
When it comes to ADHD?
Sharon Collon (18:20)
I'm gonna focus in on divorce. Like what what are they coming to you for? Like what are they saying? What's their biggest pain points?
Carolyn (18:27)
The biggest pain points are overwhelmed. They don't know where to start. This is a whole like how do we eat an elephant scenario? And they're not sure where to start with that. they want to protect their kids, and they're terrified from all of the decades of cultural learnings that we have that divorce is really bad for your children, which we now know statistically that it's not divorce that's bad, it's living in conflict that is bad. so that's a really important thing that we talk about a lot. and just I think that.
What do I do now? it's this sort of clueless, how does this work? I don't even know how this works because you're not supposed to know how it works. And yeah, how do how does it work? And what do I do? And he's telling me this. And so I don't do I believe him or no one's telling me the right things, you know, and taking legal advice from your ex is one of the biggest mistakes I see women making all the time. You know, my ex said this is fair, my ex said we should do it this way.
but it's sort of like taking advice from a fox about how to keep your hen house. So not that ex isn't inherently bad, but you know, they have a lot to gain from you not doing well. So there's a lot of that. And I think just but the children and the overwhelm are the two really big ones.
Sharon Collon (19:29)
If you could turn back the clock, right? And you said that on that night on New Year's Eve, you already had made your mind up, right? But if you could turn back the clock and give yourself some advice prior to that evening, you know, some things that perhaps you'd wish you had got organized or you know, something that you had pulled together, some information you had collated, or something, what advice would you give yourself?
Carolyn (19:50)
Wow. That's a great question. I think I would say get advice, get help, because I was very much that kind of person that to everybody outside, everything seemed fine. Nobody knew anything was wrong. And I kept going like that after he left. I was still everything's fine. Everything is fine. No problem. I was like a duck with my legs going under the water. And I didn't reach out for help.
I didn't build my support network. I didn't tell, you know, my kids school. I didn't tell apart from my closest friends, I didn't tell lots of people at first. I didn't get legal advice. I didn't didn't really like gather that support that I think is, especially as women, that we so need. because I didn't, I thought that I had to do it all myself. So that was the thing I think that I would go back and go, you don't have to do it all yourself, just you know.
Help yourself. Do yourself a favor. And you don't, yeah, there's no, there's no prizes for being a martyr in this situation. So yeah, reach out for support, ask for help. Tell the people who are who can help you. Tell your neighbors that that maybe they can help with school runs or, you know, all of the people that can help you. I didn't do that. And I wish I'd done that.
Sharon Collon (20:52)
And what was the cost of not doing that?
Carolyn (20:54)
White knuckles, I think the what I was alluding to before. I think I just felt like I had to have everything together all the time. I couldn't ask for special consideration for anything. So, you know, I was making sure my bills were paid, I was making sure I was turning up to work, getting the kids where they needed to be. I think, you know, financially I was in a really tough spot there for a while. And I was really every week I was playing that game of am I going to be able to make rent this week? And, you know.
paying for my kids' extracurricular activities. And could have gone, you know, to my daughter's ballet teacher and gone, hey, can I be on a payment plan? I didn't do any of that. I just went, I have to make it work. so yeah, stress, stress for sure. I think it took me a while to to scrape myself off the ceiling.
Sharon Collon (21:35)
Mm-hmm.
Okay. I want to ask a question about energy because a lot of mums who are doing the lion's share of the invisible load, child rearing, working, now responsible for managing all their child's appointments, like a second full-time job, you know, with without the support of an ex or an ex who's doing a lot less, perhaps.
What would you suggest that is the most important things that you put your energy into? Because energy is so limited, isn't it?
Carolyn (22:02)
so limited. Sometimes more than others, but especially times like that. The first thing I would say is a lot of I know I found and a lot of women I talk to find that actually my capacity probably increased rather than decreased after we separated because I was doing all of those things anyway. So instead of being resentful that somebody else wasn't helping me, I just got on with it. And it was actually easier. and I didn't, there wasn't that drag of having somebody
Getting in the way of what I wanted to do. So I could parent the way I wanted to parent, didn't have to negotiate with anybody. That was great. But also acknowledge that there's a lot that you're still responsible for and you are one person. And I think for me, especially because I started working those 4 a.m. shifts writing the news, I brought my kids on board. They were young, but I taught them skills that.
Service well even now. You know, my youngest was four, but she learnt how to pull together her kindy lunchbox in the mornings. And they had all these, they had these little tasks they had on the fridge, or my fridge was full of lists of things. And so I brought them along. I asked for their help. They were wonderful. You know, they really got on board with it. It probably helped that they couldn't play with their iPads until they'd done those things. but they were motivated and we worked as a team. And I think I really, talked to them a lot.
about working as a team and and working together. And I think they really got on board with that, which was really helpful.
Sharon Collon (23:15)
So what about looking after the mum? You know, so you've got you're doing four AM starts, right? Which is wild. And you're doing all of the things, do you have any tips on how to, you know, prevent the mum from burning out?
Carolyn (23:30)
Yeah, I think self-care is something we talk about a lot. And there's so many different types of self-care. It's at and I had to learn this the hard way myself because I was ticking things off my list. I'm doing and I'm doing this and I'm doing this. Why aren't I relaxed? Instead of actually just caring for myself in a more nurturing way. So I think it's all lovely to have your baths and your, you know, nice cup of tea in the sun and all that sort of stuff. But I think actually the best thing we can do when it comes to caring for ourselves.
and and you know, shoring up our capacity is to listen to our bodies, listen to our hearts and our minds and and go and ask ourselves, check in regularly and go, what do I need right now? What is it that I just need to sit and not be responsible for anything? Or is it that, you know, I could I need to meditate and you know get back to to that kind of state? Or is it that I just need to knock off these jobs now and then I know that I'll be able to relax better.
Being rigid about it and or having a list, I find really problematic. I created a task for myself to meditate every day that year that my ex-husband moved out. And it wasn't, and that was sort of I dabbled in meditation, but I wasn't big on it. And I meditate all the time now, but it took me a few years to realize that ticking it off the list doesn't make you relaxed. It's actually being in it, you know, trying to be mindful.
Which is so annoying when you're busy. But it's that mindfulness that creates the mental space that gives you that less, you know, removes that panic, helps you to calm down and just prioritize stuff that's important. You know, like I stopped ironing my kids' school uniforms a long time ago and nobody has noticed. It's fine. we you know, we brought in breakfast for dinner one night a week. That's they thought that was so fun, and I thought it was great too. You know, all these little things you can do to make your life easier.
that nobody cares about. The world doesn't end, right? You have to do what you have to do. and just yeah, I think you have to really be in tune with yourself and just give yourself what you need. No one else is going to do it for you.
Sharon Collon (25:19)
Yeah, I love that advice so much because so often we're kind of waiting for someone to give us, I don't know, I catch myself doing this sometimes too, like waiting for someone to give me permission to do to slow down or to get out of fight or flight or to not do the thing or to just and you totally tell that to your best friend. But what you tell yourself, like with ourselves like what we give ourselves grace for is just it's I don't think we give ourselves enough grace.
Carolyn (25:44)
We don't. And also we wear busy as a badge and we shouldn't. it's not something to be proud of. It's you know, if you are busy, that means that you need help and and yeah, it's not an a state to aspire to.
Sharon Collon (25:55)
What's some of the positive things that comes out of divorce from the from the women you work with or perhaps your own story? I heard you say that, you know, there there's almost like an increase of capacity. And I've heard that before. I've heard people tell me that, that they're kind of like permission to to just kind of switch off. They're not worried. They're not sort of you know, workshopping conflict perceived or real all the time. So they have this kind of sense of freedom about managing their own life. But do you have any other positives that
have come out of it that you that were a bit unexpected.
Carolyn (26:24)
Yeah, I mean I think it really is after you get through, you know, there's obviously a lot of feelings and it's terrible. And I don't minimize that it can be very difficult, but it really is a chance for you to stop and go, What do I want out of my life? You know, and and is that the sort of relationship obviously it's not the sort of relationship you want in the future. So, you know, I did a decent amount of therapy after we separated because no matter whose fault it is, if you want to say fault.
There's always something to learn about yourself, I think, when you go through these things. So, so that opportunity to revisit yourself and go, who am I now? And what do I want out of my life? You can take it wherever you want. You don't have to compromise on anything apart from, you know, you've got kids, you probably can't move to Rio. But you can parent the way you want to parent. You can organize your career the way you want to organize your career. You can, you know, if you do decide to have another relationship, you can, you know.
Ask for what you need and be treated the way you want to be treated and just set those boundaries very early. I think it just really helps you to
Take a good long hard look at everything you've got and go, is this what I want for the rest of my life? And we don't have many opportunities like that. We're always just getting on with things. But it really is a great chance to reset. And I see that all the time. Women, we did a we actually polled our members, this is a little while ago now. We polled our members 12 months after their separation, and 100% of them said they would not go back. They don't regret it at all. Every single one of them was happy that it had happened. And I think.
If you ask that question three months in, it's a bit more dicey. But twelve months later, everyone is going, Yeah, no, this was a really good thing.
Sharon Collon (27:55)
Ooh, that is a statistic that I yeah, that that is not one that I would have thought, right? Like, especially if the the divorce is not your reason. But I'm so happy that that is the case.
Carolyn (28:04)
Me too. I was so overjoyed. I expected it to be high, but I didn't think it would be like a hundred.
Sharon Collon (28:09)
Yeah. that's great. Okay. So I want to delve into the particularly women, because I know I my demographic that listens to this podcast. what are they scared about when they're thinking about getting a divorce? So whether it's their idea or their partner's idea, what's their fears around divorce? Because I feel like it's one of those things that people have a lot of fears about that perhaps we can dispel some of those myths for them.
Carolyn (28:33)
Yeah, for sure. I mean, the unknown. the unknown is always scary. but I think that the biggest fears that come up are what's going to happen to the children? Are the children going to be affected? how am I going to support myself? What are my finances going to look like? and there's also that resistance around, we had our life planned out. This is what I thought life was going to look like. And now it's like the whole rug is being pulled out from everything, everything that you had been planning.
Know is no longer real. I mean, it was never real, it was always just a plan. But I think that that can be really confronting too. So between those three things, I think, yeah, that's those are the things that people are scared of. and when it comes to children, I think, as we covered before, you know, children are so much better off with without conflict. and that doesn't mean if you have one of those terrible marriages where you just don't even speak to each other, that's better for them. That's not either.
I it was really important to me that my children saw either no relationship or what a healthy, loving relationship looks like. And that's not what they were seeing. We were just living our separate lives in our home and not really communicating at all. so I think to dispel that one, children are so much better off. and there's all sorts of statistics that say this too: that getting the first year can be tough and it can be a difficult, difficult adjustment period. And I know
I think especially with ADHD, we, you know, transitions are tough and we don't necessarily like starting a new thing. And it can be hard to know where to start. So that can be overwhelming. But children, I mean, I hear from women I work with all the time, and I experience this myself. I'm so much closer to my children because we went through that together. And they, it's really funny the things that they remember fondly. Like when my ex-husband moved out, he took a lot of the furniture.
And we were having furniture delivered the day after he moved out. So we all slept on cushions on the floor, in the lounge room floor that night. And my kids still remember that night as being so special and fun because we're all together and I think we got pizza and we watched some TV and they just they they're not aware of what's going on around it. They were just they just thought it was so fun. and they get you to themselves, you know, in a way that they don't when you're a couple. So
I think that's the biggest surprise I hear from women once they're down the track is my relationship with my kids is so much better.
Sharon Collon (30:37)
That's amazing. Such great advice in there.
So I would love to ask you, what support should our beautiful listeners call in if they're thinking about getting a divorce?
Carolyn (30:46)
Look, I think it depends on on what they know and what they don't know. It can be, you know, if it's this great big kind of scary thing that you're not ready for, I think it's great to have, you know, they can find us at Women's Divorce Academy. We have an online content platform that you can have membership of and you can access all sorts of different interviews with experts like divorce law, psychology, career.
confidence, finance, real estate, all sorts of things that, you know, so much changes when you're going through divorce. So we have interviews on there, we have templates that they can use with like budgeting and with property settlement and all that sort of thing, and scripts that they can use for challenging conversations. lots of like fact sheets and guides on how to deal with center link, how to deal with you know, child support system, all that sort of thing. There's it can be a lot because there's so many different aspects of it. And
If you Google it, you'll lose your mind. There's so much information out there and so so much misinformation out there too. So, you know, that we have that membership. They can come in and they can just dip in and out depending on what they want. I offer one-on-one coaching as well with clients. I work with them one-on-one once a month just to check in and see where they're at, what they need, who they need to be connected with, if they want recommendations for a lawyer, a psychologist, a property manager, whatever it is. we do that too. And also
If there's just one specific thing that they need help with, we also have packages they can get something about what how that property settlement process works and what they need to do. and they or how like how to take care of your kids during this time because that's a really big one as well. So we have some templates and some some webinars and things there they can watch, which are really helpful as well. So I like to I'm not an expert on anything, but I know a bit about everything. And then I bring in
all the very clever people to to share their knowledge. So from forensic accountants to to family lawyers to, you know, yeah, their everything. It's the joy of being a having a journalist background. I was by the time I started Women's Divorce Academy, I was very well connected. So I was just pulling people in everywhere.
Sharon Collon (32:40)
I love that. And I just like that you can streamline it for people. I mean, it's already such an intense time and a transition, as you said, that we don't need to go down so many Google rabbit holes. We'll end up absorbing information from the states that are not relevant to Australia and all that sort of stuff. So it can make it so much harder than it needs to be.
Carolyn (32:56)
And it can send you into a spiral. It's so overwhelming. And I think that it's just just, yeah, as you say, like having one place you can go to and and and it's the does it's designed to because I know it's overwhelming. It's designed to lessen your overwhelm rather than increase it. It's not another thing to add to your to-do list. It's more for you to go, I've got this problem. How can I solve it? And and you can go and sort that out. And you know, we're always every month we're we're putting in new content.
that our members ask for. So we're making sure that we're staying up to date with what people need. so it's really designed to lighten your load, because I know how heavy that is.
Sharon Collon (33:30)
Thank you so much for sharing your wisdom with us today. It was so amazing hearing a little bit about your story and also, you know, how you can support other women who are navigating this because it's a tricky time.
Carolyn (33:40)
It is a tricky time, but I really I I'll I love talking about it. I'll talk about it till the cows come home. So thanks for having me. Thank you.
